Lists of Twitter users; a few thoughts

The first thing to say is that I said 'lists of Twitter users' not 'Twitter lists'. Now that Twitter has rolled out the lists option to everyone there's a lot of discussion about the basic concept of putting people into lists, yet this isn't new - it's been around for a while.

I suppose the first version is the 'Follow Friday' concept where people can suggest people to follow. All nice and cosy, and a lovely idea, but it just doesn't work properly - it's either just as many people you can put into a tweet, or a smaller number with a brief description of why they should be followed. It's also a very casual system without any archival aspect, so if you're thinking that I'm pushing the Follow Friday too far into the lists concept I'd probably agree with you.

The first Twitter list concept that I came up with was when I started to use Tweetdeck; creating groups of people that I could follow in different areas - UK librarians, US librarians and so on. This allows me to just see the tweets from those people, filter their tweets, search on them and so on. Of course, these groupings are entirely private and not available for anyone else to see or use.

Public listings have been available ever since people started to create directories of Twitter users, such as Wefollow and it's easy to see a collection of librarians for example, either by number of followers or by influence. Easy to follow and people can choose to be on lists or not as they choose.

Then we've got the Tweepml concept which works very well with Tweepsearch to quickly create lists of virtually any type. The members of the list(s) are defined and controlled by the creator, although people can suggest that they should be on specific lists. These lists are designed to be public and shared. The limit of 100 people on a single list was lifted a while back and increased to 250. I've certainly created a couple of these lists, but unless they're kept at the front of people's minds it's all too easy to forget them. Obviously it's not a list of tweets, just of people.

Finally we come to Twitter lists themselves. Anyone can create a list, call it what they want, add who they feel like and let anyone follow the list (or keep it private of course). Once you follow a list you can simply click on the link in the right hand Twitter menu bar and read the tweets of the people in the list. This is something that is causing lots of people lots of problems. I don't think Twitter has been very intelligent about the way in which the lists have been rolled out. For example, I can create a list called 'Stupid Librarians' and put anyone I like onto the list, irrespective of their wishes in the matter. Twitter doesn't inform people that they've been added to lists; the only way that you can find this is to click on the link on your own Twitter page. I was somewhat surprised to find that I was on over 30 lists that people had created (and I have no idea how many private ones). I'd need to go through the entire collection in order to check to make sure that I'm not on a 'stupid librarian' list, which isn't an ideal way to work. Of course, if I was on a list and didn't want to be, the only way (other than asking to be removed) that I could get off a list is to block the creator. This really isn't an acceptable option and requires me to do a fair bit of work. Better would be for Twitter to give me the option of being blocked from public lists, or give me the option of choosing if I want to be on or off a specific list.

Some people think that the list concept makes Twitter more dangerous to use. I think this is something of an exaggeration; I don't agree with one of the basic concepts that it's going to make life easier for spammers. They can send @reply spam at the moment, and I see little to suggest that spammers are targetting specific users or types of users - that's not how spam generally works.

What I do find interesting, and haven't seen anyone talking about yet is the way in which lists are totally changing the way in which Twitter works. The whole following/follower concept might now begin to break down. I can follow a list, and read what people are saying without the necessity of following them. In turn people can follow my tweets easily, without having to become a follower. This doesn't particularly bother me, but then I've never bought into the 'more followers the better' concept. This might make it more difficult for people to get noticed on the system though, and I suspect the importance of particular people will skyrocket. New users will be able to identify key players and subscribe to their lists and lurk, without contributing themselves. To an extent they can do that already - I'm followed by lots of people (and follow back), but they seldom if ever contribute to the twitterstream, and I think the Twitter lists concept is going to make this even easier.

Another key element with the list idea is that, as with Tweetdeck, I can now create my own list of 'favourites', keep it private and just refer to that, rather than my entire twitterstream. So I can just merrily add anyone and everyone now on a one to one basis, but still only follow a much smaller number. Again, this isn't a new concept, But Twitter is now making it much easier, and I think it's devalued the entire concept of followers/following, though it could be argued that it was a flawed concept right from the first person who though they were better than someone else because they had more followers.

I'm not sure that it's going to make me use the native interface any more than I am currently doing - I prefer Tweetdeck for the iPhone and Brizzly for the web interface, and if I'm keen on lists or groups they're easy to create in those resources. Twitter is going to have to work much harder to get me to go back (and see their adverts as a result) than this.

I don't think lists is going to make Twitter more 'dangerous' to use; I don't think it's going to increase spam in any great amount, but I do think that it's putting a very large nail into the basic premise of the service. If this is detrimental to Twitter in the long run I'm not sure; we'll need to wait a while and see how people end up using the list concept.

Comments

[Katy Wrathall]

I thought Twitter lists were a good idea initially, especially as I normally don't have access to Tweetdeck or similar. But I do have a niggling concern they could become a popularity contest. I think I shall probably make them private, after all they are personal to me and not much use to anyone else.

[Sarah Barker]

My thoughts...well I first thought lists, what fun and merrily went and set up a few, the most obvious one being librarians. Then other lists followed and I gave one the name greatforalaugh meaning they were fun people to tweet with. But what if the people on this list misinterpreted the meaning behind the name. What if people felt they should be on the list and a few more what ifs. Looking at some lists I've been listed on, they really are quite bizarre. I originally set up a few lists and took my time to come up with a non-offensive name and then I thought, why am I doing this? I use Tweetdeck as my main twitter interface. I already have everyone in columns and can filter out conversations or zoom into conversations when I want. At work I use the web interface but am usually way too busy to tweet, so it's a cursory glance only. I have now deleted all my lists except for my librarians which will be useful at work. I felt that it all boils down to a popularity contest and that I didn't join twitter to follow lists. I follow people and the uniqueness of the individual.

[Sarah Nicholas]

Yes, well said! Lists are a typical example of rendering complicated, for the sake of appearing constantly innovative, an idea initially beautiful in its simplicity. Perhaps I'm a technological luddite? Perhaps not, for I have embraced certain enhancements that did not interfere with the basic follower/follower concept underpinning Twitter, and I happily privately organise people within TweetDeck.

I agree with tweets from @sarahgb and @SmilyLibrarian re lists becoming a popularity contest and rendering emotive the most simple exchange of tweets with those who have not chosen to list you in some amusing fashion or other.

I must admit a degree of cynicism re the timing of the release of lists. It came hot on the heels of the buzz surrounding Google Wave and what I felt to be a brief lull in tweeting in favour of waving. Hm.

[Helen Stein]

Every time I sit at the PC now Nicholas Carr's article Is Google Making us Stupid (http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200807/google) sneaks into my mind and then earlier I saw this Peggy Orenstein article (http://bit.ly/1lFZLd) and thought about all the kerfuffle with lists on Twitter. I haven't and won't make any lists on Twitter. I have my reasons for using Twitter and manage that use well enough without lists. Pretty much all the discussion thus far seems to have been about the fact that there are already ways of managing Twitter streams and after that it's about not offending people. Overnight I found I was on 8 lists, which is fine. I'm not going to do anything about getting off them, partly because I don't mind the ones I seem to be on and partly because the effort of discovering that I'm on the 'stupid idiot' list of someone would be way more than I could deal with! I will be self-binding, however, in an offline place where I can read, write and think without the constant clacking of keyboards, bleeping mobiles and bleed out from too-loud head-phones. At all other times I will be the one providing all these distractions! And now I have to go as Mr Stein has dished up our meal and is standing at the foot of the stairs with a knife and fork... (perhaps edit that last bit Phil!)